Questions about S17 options v standard features

Discuss Jerry Montgomery designed pocket cruiser SAGE 17

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papalou44
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Questions about S17 options v standard features

#1 Post by papalou44 » Wed Jul 06, 2016 4:20 pm

I don't understand why Sage makes features options that most quality boats make standard equipment. For example, the bilge pump, navigation lights, positive flotation. I have owned 3 boats, 2 Arimas and 1 Mako. All these things were standard. So what is the deal? A bilge pump is a cheap addition and is necessary I think. Aren't nav lights required by the Coast Guard? Anyone venturing offshore will want positive flotation as will your insurance carrier.

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scoob
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#2 Post by scoob » Wed Jul 06, 2016 5:19 pm

thanks for the questions 'papalou'. i moved your post to its own topic for clarity.

papalou44 wrote:I don't understand why Sage makes features options that most quality boats make standard equipment.
there is a wide range of how folks use boats in this size class. the items offered as options are not required for safe (yes i agree that 'safe' to one person may not be 'safe' for anther) use of the boat and some are not needed at all for how the Sage 17 will be used.

papalou44 wrote:bilge pump
many Sage 17 owners are fully comfortable using the mechanically simple bucket. the saying is, 'there is no better bilge pump than a boater with a bucket.'

papalou44 wrote:navigation lights ... Aren't nav lights required by the Coast Guard?
navigation lights are not required unless one is out at night or reduced visibility. there are also some special rules for specific bodies of water.

under USCG rule 25 d) (i) A sailing vessel of less than 7 meter in length shall, if practicable, exhibit the lights prescribed in Rule 25(a) or (b), but if she does not, she shall [exhibit an all around white light or] have ready at hand an electric torch or lighted lantern showing a white light which shall be exhibited in sufficient time to prevent collision

if under power [outboard] must have running lights (bi-color bow and 360-degree masthead).

some Sage 17 owners have no interest in being out at night and never have been out at night. i sailed my old Montgomery 15 for many years with no running nights ... as i didn't sail/motor at night. on my Montgomery 17 i've only been out once in the seven years i've owned the boat when i needed running lights (the boat does have running lights now .. though at the time i was out at night she only had a tri-color at the masthead for sailing and none for motoring). the demo Sage 17 AIR BORN has running lights which i've used a total of three times in the past five years.

there are also a few Sage 17 owners that opted for using the individual battery operated lights that can be attached to the bow pulpit and run up the mast for a 360-deg white.

papalou44 wrote:positive flotation. Anyone venturing offshore will want positive flotation as will your insurance carrier.

Sage 17 isn't required to have positive flotation. Sage Marine's insurance company limits me to no more than 10-miles off-shore (meaning 10 miles off the Pacific Coast, in the Gulf of Mexico and Atlantic coast). I'm under the same limitations with private insurance on my personal boats. the underwriter never asked if the boats have flotation.

flotation is a personal thing in my option. if i purchased a Sage 17 i would not have flotation as it reduces storage space. i also learned to sail on boats that would sink (meaning they had no flotation). the boat my folks eventually owned was a Richards designed Cheoy Lee 32. a blue-water capable boat that didn't have positive flotation. i don't spend much time thinking about sinking.

this is a 'to each there own' item and therefore is an option to meet the owner's wishes. about 25% of the Sage 17s have no flotation foam.

papalou44 wrote:I have owned 3 boats, 2 Arimas and 1 Mako.I have owned 3 boats, 2 Arimas and 1 Mako.
i don't know the specific models of the boats you have owned. being power boats, unless i missed a sailboat being offered by these manufactures, there are different rules for craft that primary thrust is sail v. motor. production power boats less than 20' long must have flotation. they also must pass a flotation test conducted by the USCG (the builder provides a boat to the Feds and they drill holes in the boat so NO air can be captured and foam must keep the boat above water and floating level with weights placed on available seating to duplicate the humans on-board).

another craft that must have position flotation are 'dinghies'.


Sage Marine builds the Sage 17 as a semi-customizable sailboat. We work with each owner to build a craft to meet their type of sailing, cruising, etc.

Please post more questions as you have them. You can also give me a call at 800-621-1065.

Thanks for your interest in the Sage 17.
--
:: Dave Scobie
::
::
:: my boat's www-site - http://www.m17-375.webs.com

papalou44
Posts: 4
Joined: Thu Jun 02, 2016 3:48 pm

questions about S17 options vs standard features

#3 Post by papalou44 » Thu Jul 07, 2016 9:21 am

Thanks for the prompt reply to my questions. That makes sense to me. I know you can bail a canoe with a bucket, but the boats I previously owned had bilges which
were not accessible since they are below decks. So a bilge pump is very necessary. I remember once being 25 miles off the Oregon coast fishing for halibut. Some
waves were slopping over the transom and before long we were ankle deep in water on the deck. The bilge pump failed for some reason. After that I installed a
backup pump with 4x the capacity of the standard pump wired directly to the battery (but fused of coarse).

Also, boats tied up to the dock in Wheeler, Or. were known to sink due to nighttime downpours which filled the boats with rainwater. Boats with pumps were OK.

I agree, everyone has their own list of "must haves". You satisfied my curiosity.

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